Looking for...

[Stan]

Looking for the FLUSH lever on AT. Has anyone seen that?
The bowl seems to be overflowing.

[Breezy]

My thoughts exactly!!

It seems the longer this drags out--the worse and more desperate those on AT get!!!

I've tried to find the flush lever too....

[Breezy]

It looks to me like the floodgates have opened and it is a free-for-all over on Advent Talk forum. With Daryl Fawcett leaving, now anything goes! Interesting how the discussion can get so slimy but when Ian posts there saying nothing that breaks the rules, Snoopy loves to write in red against her. That is why we have this forum here. Forget it over there--it is a slime-pit anyway.

[Cynthia]

It looks to me like the floodgates have opened and it is a free-for-all over on Advent Talk forum. With Daryl Fawcett leaving, now anything goes! Interesting how the discussion can get so slimy but when Ian posts there saying nothing that breaks the rules, Snoopy loves to write in red against her. That is why we have this forum here. Forget it over there--it is a slime-pit anyway.

Yes mostly it is a waste of time. But in all fairness I do have to admit I did post a "laters swiss miss" to Sister/Kris Fiscalini which caused Snoopy to get out her scissors and get Snippy... lol lol.. and top post a little excitedly:

ADMIN HAT ON

Ian, you need to watch yourself. I don't have time to follow you around and edit all of your inappropriate posts!!

ADMIN HAT OFF


Now if only she could use those eagle eyes and scissors on the posts of some of the equally deserving others who post there...

[Cynthia]

Things that make you go Hmmmm...

I didn't know where to post this, so I guess this will do, as Snoopy's snips are already in play in this topic.

They have been deleting links to this forum ( not in their posted rules btw as I am thinking they don't want all to know that) so up till now I have simply posted "go to 3atalkto read it" or something like that, as have others- and they left it alone. But it seems that they will no longer allow anyone to refer to this forum by name anymore either-- going by Snoopy's last edit.

What is also interesting as we have been trying to ask for the longest who owns advent talk and who is on that secret "team" with no answers from them. Lynda Walcker/Sonshineonme also edited a link to this forum out of that same post which I had posted in reply to Bob's cherry picking one.

What is also slightly amusing about that is that as of the time she did so she was not listed as a moderator or administrator, whether in training or as a full one. I anticipate they will fix that shortly and do some edits like when Dr Artiste Westphal suddenly jumped in and edited a post (oops!) and has been a moderator ever since...

1.)

... [Bob's Post] ...

Cherry picking again.. to present a warped view. To read the
entire thing in context go to 3atalk

http://www.3atalk.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=170

2.)

Cherry picking again.. to present a warped view.To read the
entire thing in context go to 3atalk

« Last Edit: Today at 09:01:49 AM by sonshineonme »

(Huh? smiley) (Scratch head smiley)

Advent Talk > Issues & Concerns Category > 3ABN (Moderators: Chrissie, Artiste, Snoopy, Emma) > Questions I wish I could ask Danny Shelton on CA

3.)

Cherry picking again.. to present a warped view.

« Last Edit: Today at 09:01:49 AM by sonshineonme »

(Huh? smiley) (Scratch head smiley)

Advent Talk > Issues & Concerns Category > 3ABN (Moderators: Chrissie, Artiste, Snoopy, Emma) > Questions I wish I could ask Danny Shelton on CA

Edited to remove inappropriate reference in quoted post.
« Last Edit: Today at 10:22:55 AM by Snoopy »

so silly

Of course what is not funny, is that with those edits they have effectively blocked others from getting to read the whole thing in context for themselves and so be able judge for themselves, rather than just getting the Pickle spin. I regard that as censorship...

[Breezy]

censorship--what a novel idea--if anyone should disagree with you, you just censor them! Like I said, REAL TRUTH has nothing to hide--but it seems AT has a LOT to hide. So if you dare say anything they don't like, the sissors will go "snip snip snip" by Snippy-Snoopy. How about that for one-sidedness?

Their problem is they DON'T WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH!!! They only want the juiciest of gossip and if they can't find it, they will make it up.

And Pickle whines that he cannot go before the 3ABN board to tell of all his little discoveries....um, Pickle, the Board members are not living at 3ABN and they SUED you, remember? The "stupid lawsuit" as you referred to it (remember you started all this in the first place). This board is made up of successful businessmen who are busy. They are too busy working as a Board furthering the work of the Lord--to come down "off the wall" to mess with whiners of inconsequential fallacies.

[Sam]

censorship--what a novel idea--if anyone should disagree with you, you just censor them! Like I said, REAL TRUTH has nothing to hide--but it seems AT has a LOT to hide. So if you dare say anything they don't like, the sissors will go "snip snip snip" by Snippy-Snoopy. How about that for one-sidedness?

Their problem is they DON'T WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH!!! They only want the juiciest of gossip and if they can't find it, they will make it up.

And Pickle whines that he cannot go before the 3ABN board to tell of all his little discoveries....um, Pickle, the Board members are not living at 3ABN and they SUED you, remember? The "stupid lawsuit" as you referred to it (remember you started all this in the first place). This board is made up of successful businessmen who are busy. They are too busy working as a Board furthering the work of the Lord--to come down "off the wall" to mess with whiners of inconsequential fallacies.

I read where Pickle said "where have I said anything that wasn't 100% true"? I about fell over laughing. The question would be more like where has he written anything true.

For instance...he says Danny knew he didn't have biblical grounds for remarriage. Now how could PIckle know or prove what he says "Danny knew"? Pickle can never say as a fact what Danny knew or what Danny thought. Just as Picle can never prove or be sure that Linda did not commit adultery.

Pickle told Sam that Sam couldn't be believed without documentation. Give me a break. Where is Pickle's documentation? If he is calling written statements by the he said/she said crowd that hardly qualifies as documentation. Without writing a book I will point out the error in pickles so called facts:

1.He says that Danny covered up child molestation charges against Tommy. If so, how did he do that? Pickle should be reminded that in the USA a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. Tommy has never been charged with any child molestation. He is not on a sexual predators list. He did not have to move out of state because he is not allowed to live in Illinois as reported by some of you. Tommy is not a criminal. Many years ago the police, lead by an Illinois State Policeman looked at the allegations and heard both sides and decided to drop any further investigation as there was no merit in what the accuser(s) said. That is a fact: It is a matter of record. There is no record to the contrary, if so prove it. What you have had all of this time is "he said/she said". Show the documentation or stop your accusations. This is not Christian. You know what I say here is true or you would have already exposed these findings on Net.

It doesn't make any difference how many accusers one has. It does matter if the authorities or courts believe what the accusers say or not. Take for example: Joy and Pickle have made too numerous accusations to count about dishonesty of DS and 3ABN financially. BUT, the IRS, the highest court in the land for financial dishonesty closed down the nearly year long investigation of over 100,000 pages of documents! It doesn't matter that Fran and whomever doesn't believe that it's over. The IRS closure totally nullified all that Pickle and Joy have said. Who will the public believe? The IRS or Pickle and Joy? The case is closed, period. This is a perfect example of what I was talking about. It's not the number of accusers, it's the facts that decides the case. The IRS had all the facts and no ax to grind. Not so for the opponents.

For an example of the flip side of the coin let's use Gailon Joy for an example. Gailon claims he is innocent of Embezzling funds, a felony. To this day he still denies that he stole from anyone even though he lost his appeals in court. Again, it doesn't make any difference what Gailon says. He can color his crime all he wants with his words but it will not change the truth. Contrary to his denial the court records show that the judge found him guilty of embezzlement. To deny those official charges would be lying.

Same can be said for a number of folk in the little group at AT. Lynette /snoopy: the records show she was arrested and charged with stalking. That's a fact. Mrs. Westphal, guilty by the law, period. This cannot be disputed no matter how colorful their words are when excusing what they've done. Their crimes are a matter of public record put out by the court.

I didn't accuse Gailon of being an embezzler, the court says he's an embezzler and convicted him of the crime. Same with Westphal,(Artiste): Same with Lynette: it is a matter of record. Big difference between he said/ she said and a conviction or even being charged in a court of law.

Danny and the board chose to hire Tommy years ago and their choice was a good one. Tommy was and is greatly admired by most all of the 3ABN workers that he worked close with for many years. Within one year from the time Tommy took over production in 2004 3ABN's production of programming jumped around 60%. For many years he has shown himself an honorable and trustworthy employee.

There has been no cover up of child molestation charges against Tommy. Allegations are just that and can be spread by anyone that allows Satan to use them. Jesus has more allegations against him than anyone in the history of the world.The allegations against our Savior are of course not true though Satan has convinced most of the world that they are facts. Eternal burning hell for instance. Even most Christian organizations believe and or teach this lie about God's character as though it is a fact. These allegations are lies. God is not a God who torturs his creation for eternity if they don't accept him. I know Mr. Clem disagrees with me on that one but.....Back to my point. 3ABN could not even exist today if we held everyone accountable for every allegation and or mistake that they have made in the last 25-30 years because every one of us and all of you reading have been guilty of nailing Jesus to the cross in that length of time.
No matter where one goes to interview for a job, does the would be employer investigate the last 30 years of their life to see if they sinned or made mistakes in that time frame? Ridiculous. Of course not.

A few years ago a ministry had an employee who was named by a number of female co workers of sexual harassment. Each one was willing to testify that he was guilty of sexual harassment. He left almost immediately and was soon hired by the GC. When he left that ministry, those involved prayed with him and encouraged him to tell the truth but when he didn't they realized that this man's salvation is between him and God alone. They did not go public with this man's sins. I believe some at the GC knew about his past but they allowed him to work there anyway. Mr. Pickle would do well to realize that it wasn't that ministries job to continue to accuse and antagonize that man. It was not the ministries responsibility to judge the GC for hiring him even though they may have known of his "problem".

Even when people make mistakes we as individual Christians and 3ABN as a Christian organization needs to help mend and restore those that are willing to admit their wrongs, and ask forgiveness. Derrell M, beartrap/habanero, is one such case. Derrell's divorce papers proclaim that he can never have his children overnight. The reason for that proclamation is that Derrell agreed to it because he knew he did wrong and didn't want this matter to end up in court.
This is not an expose' of Derrell, but rather an illustration. If it were I would be more specific. Hope Channel knew of Derrell's problem but didn't choose to let him go because he told Brad Thorpe and Gary Gibbs that it was a PAST problem. 3ABN leaders also knew of Derrell's problem but decided to let him stay on because he likewise told them that his "problem" was in the past. Derrell showed signs of remorse and asked for prayer. Pastor Johny D. also prayed with him over this problem. Pastor Thomas the T'ville pastor knew of this problem and even censored DM for six months. These are facts that can and have been proven. Yet everyone was willing to try and give him help and support. Danny was willing to allow him to continue to work at 3abn regardless that Darrell and Melody were divorced, regardless of Derrell's self confessed problem and regardless of Danny's personal feelings over the situation.

Even after being told that Derrell was on the internet telling lies about Danny and 3abn, painting everything in the worst light possible, Danny, Melody and 3abn chose not to go public with proof of Derrell's problems. In my mind there is no excuse or justification for Derrell's actions against 3abn. He has repaid their kindness and christian actions with lies.

I'm amazed that so many on AT who are casting stones at DS, 3ABN, and others have been exposed themselves of crimes that are now public record by the courts.

There are a great number of allegations surfacing about Bob Pickle and his past but the 3ABN people have not made them public. There is no doubt these dubious sins will become public by other means. The bible says if you roll a stone it will roll back on you. GJ, Lynette, Mrs. Westphal, Derrell M, Duane Clem
are a few examples of people trying to roll a stone on someone. I fear, because of their sad choices that stone will roll back on them even moreso than it has already. Even Linda that you all hold to such high esteem of integrity and honesty has been sanctioned by the court for not being truthful.(That's the nice way of putting it) She had to pay several thousand dollars of Danny's attorneys fees. Again, not speculation. Court record.

Funny thing. Through all of this we have found that a good number of these AT people actually have criminal records and yet DS, 3ABN board of directors, Tommy, Mollie, Dr. Walt, John L, and a number of others at 3ABN have no criminal records at all. It does seem a case of the guilty accusing others of things they have done. Gailon accuses Danny of wrongful financial dealings yet he, Gailon is the convicted Embezzler! Once again "saying it's so" doesn't make it so at all. Now the IRS saying it isn't so is a completely different thing isn't it?

Bob what documents do you have to prove Joy's claim that Danny was taking money from 3abn for personal use?

Bob you have said repeatedly that Shelley Quinn got on national TV and badmouthed Allyssa. Can you prove she was even referring to Allysa? Then you say that Danny orchestrated the whole thing. Where is your proof that he did? Where is your documentation of proof against Shelley or Danny?

Bob, we need proof that Danny divorced his wife knowing that he did not have biblical grounds. Allegations and words won't do. You cannot prove with documentation what Danny knew or didn't know. You would have to be a mind reader. In fact his emails to Linda that you published without conscience, actually show that he believed 100% that she was guilty of adultery. You saying that "he knew" this or that means nothing.

By the way, you say that Danny accused all Christians of being enemies of the gospel.... I don't believe he was referring to you as I doubt that Danny or those at 3abn consider you a Christian. Your recorded actions of false allegations against numerous people say otherwise.

[Breezy]

Thank you Sunny for showing us the real facts of the case.

[odie1962]

.

No matter where one goes to interview for a job, does the would be employer investigate the last 30 years of their life to see if they sinned or made mistakes in that time frame? Ridiculous. Of course not.

If the mistake or sin was of such a nature as to put others at risk or the org. itself at risk,someone best be looking at past conduct.

A few years ago a ministry had an employee who was named by a number of female co workers of sexual harassment. Each one was willing to testify that he was guilty of sexual harassment. He left almost immediately and was soon hired by the GC. When he left that ministry, those involved prayed with him and encouraged him to tell the truth but when he didn't they realized that this man's salvation is between him and God alone. They did not go public with this man's sins. I believe some at the GC knew about his past but they allowed him to work there anyway. Mr. Pickle would do well to realize that it wasn't that ministries job to continue to accuse and antagonize that man. It was not the ministries responsibility to judge the GC for hiring him even though they may have known of his "problem".

This is more damning than encouraging. The fact that our denomination has done this should be a matter of shame rather than pride.. Yes the individual conferences and the GC do turn a blind eye to many sins of sexual misconduct.

The man that caused our family so much heartache also did not have his sins made public for 30 years and five conferences knew and allowed the destruction of the lives of many.

This is just about the most irresponsible unchristian thing that can happen..... You said..... those involved prayed with him and encouraged him to tell the truth but when he didn't they realized that this man's salvation is between him and God alone
Not only the one guilty of sexual harrassment,but all these wonderful people that decided it was between the guilty and God should face severe penalties. Do you wonder or care about the hurt,grief,heartache and salvation of those that have to pay the price for such total irresponsibility?

Even when people make mistakes we as individual Christians and 3ABN as a Christian organization needs to help mend and restore those that are willing to admit their wrongs, and ask forgiveness. Derrell M, beartrap/habanero, is one such case. Derrell's divorce papers proclaim that he can never have his children overnight. The reason for that proclamation is that Derrell agreed to it because he knew he did wrong and didn't want this matter to end up in court.
This is not an expose' of Derrell, but rather an illustration. If it were I would be more specific. Hope Channel knew of Derrell's problem but didn't choose to let him go because he told Brad Thorpe and Gary Gibbs that it was a PAST problem. 3ABN leaders also knew of Derrell's problem but decided to let him stay on because he likewise told them that his "problem" was in the past. Derrell showed signs of remorse and asked for prayer. Pastor Johny D. also prayed with him over this problem. Pastor Thomas the T'ville pastor knew of this problem and even censored DM for six months. These are facts that can and have been proven. Yet everyone was willing to try and give him help and support. Danny was willing to allow him to continue to work at 3abn regardless that Darrell and Melody were divorced, regardless of Derrell's self confessed problem and regardless of Danny's personal feelings over the situation.

Helping to mend and restore should be part of a christian's approach. Mending and restoring and the expense of others is about as evil as it gets.
You,DS,the GC has not right to put others at risk for what they claim is mending and restoring. You take that right but it is not yours.

Let me see if you recognize some of your own thoughts. Thoughts that were expressed about the predator pastor that destroyed my sons' life and that of his innocent children and many more, to many to count that have had to encounter such irresponsibility. This is chapter and verse the excuses given for all that I have come across that have had to suffer because of such twisted reasoning

We prayed with him, he was doing good things for the Lord, Remember, all have sinned,he has shown remorse,he asked us to pray with him, the Lord quietly wrote the sins in the sand.
Great, terrific,until it hits you or yours.
All reading should have concern over the fact being made public the GC hired a man,knowing what he had done and left it between him and God. Good explanation why at one time the SDA.org was the third leading denomination with these type of lawsuits etc.

Even after being told that Derrell was on the internet telling lies about Danny and 3abn, painting everything in the worst light possible, Danny, Melody and 3abn chose not to go public with proof of Derrell's problems. In my mind there is no excuse or justification for Derrell's actions against 3abn. He has repaid their kindness and christian actions with lies.

What Derrells problem was or is ,it only needs to be made public if others have to be protected from these little mistakes.3ABN would be under no obligation to go public unless they placed him in a postion where he could re-offend,harm others.

[odie1962]

Sunny,

You have done exactly what so many complain about with adventtalk. There is no purpose to the following other than to spread innuendo and imply something.

Even when people make mistakes we as individual Christians and 3ABN as a Christian organization needs to help mend and restore those that are willing to admit their wrongs, and ask forgiveness. Derrell M, beartrap/habanero, is one such case. Derrell's divorce papers proclaim that he can never have his children overnight. The reason for that proclamation is that Derrell agreed to it because he knew he did wrong and didn't want this matter to end up in court.
This is not an expose' of Derrell, but rather an illustration. If it were I would be more specific. Hope Channel knew of Derrell's problem but didn't choose to let him go because he told Brad Thorpe and Gary Gibbs that it was a PAST problem. 3ABN leaders also knew of Derrell's problem but decided to let him stay on because he likewise told them that his "problem" was in the past. Derrell showed signs of remorse and asked for prayer. Pastor Johny D. also prayed with him over this problem. Pastor Thomas the T'ville pastor knew of this problem and even censored DM for six months. These are facts that can and have been proven. Yet everyone was willing to try and give him help and support. Danny was willing to allow him to continue to work at 3abn regardless that Darrell and Melody were divorced, regardless of Derrell's self confessed problem and regardless of Danny's personal feelings over the situation.

Again,if DS placed individuals in postions of power/authority/trust this is nothing to brag about. But OTOH,I believe it was to take a shot at someone with a little titilation and tease as to what "the problem" was.
The list you have provided of those in authority forgive, refuse to let them go etc is what is really scary. It is not about forgiveness,but responsible behaviour in protecting others. It is not even showing christian love and compassion for the guilty. It is nothing but self serving